SurvivingInfidelity.com^®

I wish to make a plea. If you are in the earlier stages of dealing with infidelity recovery, whether Betrayed or Wayward, that you consider not reading beyond this paragraph. It is my concern that this post may be of no value to you or worse cause confusion, frustration and/or more pain, and that is not my desire.

I am sharing my thoughts here for those who are much further along, years further, in their reconciliation process and have remade themselves and their marriages into something new and healthy. But, like myself, you still find moments of deep, perplexing pain. And like me, most likely the sorrow or anguish is brief and not as intense compared to years gone by but it’s lingering still causes some unkind suffering that time and hard work hasn’t fully erased.

For me, in these moments of discomfort, I find I am looking at my wife through the eyes of a betrayed husband, remembering her and her actions as she was during the time of her affair not as she is today. And from that backward looking, high-ground vista I find myself in an internal struggle between two extremely different understandings of my wife. That dichotomy causes me frustration and pain for I cannot seem to fuse the two into something that makes sense and that I can wholly trust.

I don’t know, maybe I am alone in this type of long-distance, time-stamped sting and if true this post is of little value other than a place to share my thoughts on the off-chance it might speak to and hopefully helpful to someone.

I discovered and joined Survivor Infidelity approximately 8 months ago when I found myself, after decades of little struggle over this issue, in a darkening place filled with a bewildering, but growing, personal torment. Why now! Why is it so intense? There is nothing about our relationship that carries the stench of the affair so why am I grieving and unable to sleep deeply? Why do I, once again, feel so dang alone and lost?

I was floundering in an undertow of sadness with a fearsome current pulling me away from the safety of shore and out into an open ocean of suffering. To make matters worse it was hurting my wife and I knew it was completely unfair and yet I was drowning in the dangerous, deep waters of rumination. It was tempting to blame her, for on this issue she is an easy target. And yet, in the quiet moments of self-examination I knew instinctively that this was about me and it was my struggle and that I needed to discover why and how to work through this situation. And that is where a few of you, 8 months ago, came into my world and gave of yourselves. Many listening, not sure how to assist while others were in a place of recognizing that I was in trouble and tossed me several different types of life preservers. When a few brave souls saw I was blinded by panic and could not see the flotation devices, they didn’t hesitate to jump into the water and render assistance.

One such PFD was the idea that I bring myself back into the current moment. That the past no longer exists. That I look (and see) my wife as she is now.

I took several weeks off from SI to study this idea. To weigh its truth and value without the intensity or push back from SI. It was selfish, but I had to quiet the noise so I could listen intensely to what had been offered to me. And in the self-imposed silence, I could hear a faint voice deep within me confirming that I needed to incorporate this idea into my everyday actions. Not only in this situation but in other issues as well.

Coming to the understanding that today is the only day that is important, the grueling weight of ancient pain is being gently lifted, leaving me better able to swim to the safety of shore. Which brings me to the title of this post: "An Unnecessary Suffering of My Own Creation".

It was me, refusing to let go, clinging to a past that no longer exists. I was creating my own suffering. Not my wife! Not the affair! Not her affair partner!

It was me, myself, and I, that was the threesome that was 100% causing me to suffer. For it was us three collectively who were unwilling to allow the moment, this moment, to exist as it is now.

Asterisk

Hi Asterisk -

I don’t know, maybe I am alone in this type of long-distance, time-stamped sting and if true this post is of little value other than a place to share my thoughts on the off-chance it might speak to and hopefully helpful to someone.

You are not alone in your feelings about a "long-distance, time-stamped sting". I am over 21 years out from D-Day, but I can relate to some of your posts over the past few months. I don't post often on SI, but I'm a long-time member, and I visit here only occasionally when I'm "stuck".

As my 20-year D-Day anniversary approached last year, I found that I was suffering as you have described. I knew that it was my own doing - nothing related to my wife's current behavior.

When the affair thoughts came up, I would sometimes get "stuck" (ruminating) and that would cause me to withdraw for a bit from my wife. When this happens now, I've been intentionally trying to do the opposite. Basically "leaning into" my wife instead of withdrawing. So, instead of hiding, I might intentionally go and be with her (e.g. sit with and chat) or do something (e.g. go for a walk) with my wife, to reestablish a good present-time memory.

This takes some practice and isn't always easy, but I do know that it makes me feel better afterwards. I think this is basically what you are describing - trying harder to stay in the present moment. Basically, I try to tell myself that I don't want to waste another moment thinking about something awful that was long in our past.

So, I just wanted to affirm that (1) you are not alone in facing this long-time challenge, and that (2) you have found a healthy path to handling it.

Hello Mr20Paws,

When the affair thoughts came up, I would sometimes get "stuck" (ruminating) and that would cause me to withdraw for a bit from my wife. When this happens now, I've been intentionally trying to do the opposite. Basically "leaning into" my wife instead of withdrawing. So, instead of hiding, I might intentionally go and be with her (e.g. sit with and chat) or do something (e.g. go for a walk) with my wife, to reestablish a good present-time memory.

Thank you for making this connection with me and for sharing some of your struggles when you have found yourself ruminating and what you have discovered that worked for you in relieving the pain.

Intentional current memory building!

I really like your idea.

Though my approach was well intended it was faulty in concept. When I found myself ruminating, I would sit quietly alone in a dark room and try to analyze what I was feeling and why I was feeling it. I am a big believer in not avoiding pain. No matter how much it hurt, I would reconstruct what I could remember and try to alien them with what I understood my wife to have told me. I’d examine every possible, plausible reason for why what happened, happened. I would attempt to be fair to my wife and not take the easy route and lay all the blame at her feet.

This is a technique I have successfully applied all my life to issues where I am having a conflict with someone. I’m a firm believer that rarely all the blame lies with the other person in which I am having struggles. This method has usually been a very effective way of resolving any conflicts. And honestly, in the early years of the affair, this way of processing did assist in keeping me grounded and sane. It stopped me from making desperate, panic decisions which would have resulted in poor outcomes.

However, rehashing, rethinking, reexamining an affair that is nearing 33 years past due was serving only to erode what my wife and I have diligently created. I knew I had to go about this differently and that is why I sought out this site. I’m grateful to everyone who has offered different ideas, even those that I did not see as fitting my situation. I took all the ideas and fashioned them into something that I thought would be helpful for myself and by extension my wife.

Thank you Mr20Paws for adding an additional idea of "intentionally creating new memories". I can see how that kept you present in time. I will apply this idea when I find myself ruminating. Which ruminating has fortunately been quickly offset by the idea of staying present. Your suggestion adds a way to go from not just staying present but to how to add positively to the moment, for this moment is all we truly have. Yesterday no longer exists and tomorrow has not arrived.

Asterisk

** Member to Member **

What I've always found useful in SI is the vast amount of experience that gets shared. When I dealt with an issue, I always read something that helped me find my solution. From the bottom of my heart, thanks for sharing - my W is having a very difficult time with ruminations (though not WRT her A).

I'm sorry for the pain you've been through over the past months. I'm glad you're finding new ways to defuse it. My bet is that both you and Mr20Paws will help others with your posts.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 10:40 PM, Wednesday, March 18th]

I listened to your plea Asterisk but I continued to read because I’m a rebel.

Your post reminded me of my day shopping last week, driving home listening to my music, an old song with a few lyrics that made me reflect, I thought to myself that ultimately that’s what it is Bruce, that’s what it’s going to come to, nobody is coming.

Deep in our soul a quiet ember, knows it’s you against you, it’s the paradox that drives us on.

I know what I need to do, you do too.

Your posts are of great value, some I have read more than once. Thank you Asterisk.

My wife is all of the good and the bad -- so am I.

She has seen me on my worst days, and yet, sees the best of me or my potential.

I've seen and experienced her worst fall and failures, and I am able to see all the good she is and has done, I see the best of her.

Neither of us ever expected infidelity to be a part of our story.

I was disappointed in how long it took me to heal.

Five full years of more suffering and rumination than I think I needed to experience.

However, it just really took me that long to understand me and my own healing than anything else.

In other words, I am not mad at myself anymore for taking too long.

In your case Asterisk, a lot of your thoughts were locked away -- and not processed at all, until this last year.

Give yourself as much time and space as you need.

All of get caught up in the loop, the brain is always looking for a way to make it so the A never happened. I appreciate my brain looking for a way out, but the only way is through. Through the memories, the pains, the needless 'what if' loops and trying to imagine a life with less pain in it.

Weirdly, I am okay with the pain now that I processed it.

I'm stronger, my wife is stronger, our team-up is far stronger than it has ever been.

That's why it is pretty easy for me, in the now, to focus on what we're doing well, and impressively, what we have overcome.

Sisson,

… my W is having a very difficult time with ruminations (though not WRT her A).

I am grieved to read that your wife is ruminating about something "unrelated" to her affair". I think we betrayed spouses often forget, our wayward partners suffer equally and that they ruminate as well.

I wonder if what she is ruminating about has a connection to her affair. A precursor perhaps which seems unrelated but possibly a contributor to her decision to be unfaithful. Maybe not, but something that crossed my mind. Either way, I am sorry she is struggling and I hope your wife will find some resolve soon. It is wonderful that you are supportive of her during her time of crises.

Asterisk

Bruce 123,

I listened to your plea Asterisk but I continued to read because I’m a rebel.

You rebel you. Living on the edge are you? Cracked me up.

Deep in our soul a quiet ember, knows it’s you against you, it’s the paradox that drives us on.

"…you against you….". So simply put, so simply true. You have described my situation extremely well. "…the paradox that drives us on." Again very on point. I would like to add that it is also a paradox that drives us crazy! The trick is to find what keeps up upright and moving forward.

Your posts are of great value, some I have read more than once.

You have no idea how valuable it was for me to read this line. I find myself in a tough place when trying to lend a comment of support to others here. I stare at the computer before writing thinking how can a man who has been this unsuccessful at recovery not be seen as a hypocrite? A quack to ignore. Your words of support have lifted my soul. Thank you!

Asterisk

Oldwounds,

In your case Asterisk, a lot of your thoughts were locked away -- and not processed at all, until this last year.

Yes, this is true. I was successful early on in some areas and a failure in others. With the help of others here I am in the process now of correcting those failures.

Weirdly, I am okay with the pain now that I processed it.
I'm stronger, my wife is stronger, our team-up is far stronger than it has ever been.

I don’t mind the pain for discomfort is often followed by growth. And as you stated that growth makes people and their relationships sturdier, more weathered to better manage future storms. Like the pine tree that is stranded in the crack of a cliff, gnarled, unnaturally swayed but tough as the rock it is imbedded in.

Asterisk

I think my W is trapped in the same self-hating process that enabled her to cheat. If she had been able to short circuit the process 16 years ago, I doubt that she would have cheated. Now, the same process has power, but she is addressing it in much healthier ways. So it's more that she's addressing the core issues that enabled her A - pre-A issues, if you will.

*****

We all build defenses against pain, many of which are highly dysfunctional and unhealthy. Some defenses become core beliefs that are very powerful. It takes some of us a lot of time to gather the energy to take down those unnecessary defenses, especially because the defenses themselves 'tell' us they're crucial to our survival.

When I've taken down the unnecessary defenses, I've always wondered, 'What was so hard about that?' It never seems difficult once I've done it, but the difficulty was there, nevertheless.

I very rarely use absolutes, but I think being betrayed attacks everyone's whole sense of self - and also brings back any iota of self-doubt one has ever felt. One may not be able to do the work to take down the defenses until and unless one has the mental/systemic bandwidth to do it. It's hard to find the bandwidth when raising kids and trying to keep a job, though I usually forget that.

The changes have always happened overnight for me. Yeah ... overnight after years of preparation.

[This message edited by SI Staff at 6:26 PM, Thursday, March 19th]

I think what I would term "malaise" is very common, even long term, after affairs. How can it not be, you discovered a whole side of your spouse, a very negative and destructive side that hurt you greatly. You never thought that could possible happen, for many people it seems to come out of nowhere as a great surprise. How then can something you never knew existed before, and that emerged out of seemingly nowhere, be trusted not to emerge again? That doesn't make sense to me. It would be reasonable to expect this is a basic flaw in their system and that it can occur again, perhaps not in the same way, but it some other way. And you've seen that they really don't.....love you that much....or they wouldn't be able to do this. So I think people twist themselves into pretzels trying to believe that spouse has essentially changed, when that is still an article of faith that has been disproven in the past - my own feeling is, if they cheated once, they can cheat again, this is part of their nature, part of who they are. Can they change? Perhaps, but I think actual change is rare. If the stars align again and temptation presents itself, the possibility exists that they can do this again because...it's already been a reality.

So I think people have to stop beating themselves up because on some level, they know this. So you decide for whatever reasons, that you're willing to take this chance. There are times when you're gonna feel insecure, or down, or triggered, or threatened, or whatever the intensity level is, because this happened before, and somewhere in yourself, you feel, which is rational, that this COULD happen again. Perhaps it's like playing a dangerous sport that one loves, but has been severely injured in....do you play it again? Perhaps, but with the knowledge that a serious injury could happen again. Those are the risks we take in staying in a broken relationship and trying to fix it to a point where it can be workable again. And like a broken bone, there are times when that's gonna ache or act up because that never goes away.

So by staying in a marriage with a person who has been unfaithful we take that risk, for whatever reasons, they might be unfaithful again should a certain circumstance arise. That's often where triggers come from, at least for me, when I see behaviors that remind me that he could.....do it again, and unless I constantly play marriage police, which I don't want to do, there's going to be a certain element of risk. Uncertainty and some level of insecurity, is the permanent price of infidelity....and I'm sure it affects the unfaithful spouse too because they're never gonna be spotless again. If I see my husband talking too long or too animatedly to another attractive woman, I feel insecure. But I can't stop him from talking to half the human race. Nor is there anything wrong with ME for feeling like that. It's his fault actually. I just have to decide if it's worth the price of staying. Right now, financially, it is.

I just wish betrayed spouses did not seem to beat themselves up because they still have insecurity or concerns or twinges or triggers or doubts or shadows or however we term it that come up at times because of the infidelity because....I don't see how that can be avoided in the overwhelming majority of people who have been through this. You KNOW they are capable of this, you KNOW they are capable of massive lying and deceit, you KNOW that they might be capable of abandonment (if it went that far)....you can't not know what you know.

So blame THEM, blame the unfaithful, it is THEIR FAULT, and stop blaming yourself. It is part of the price of trying to fix what THEY did.

[This message edited by BondJaneBond at 7:22 PM, Thursday, March 19th]

Sisson,

… the core issues that enabled her A - pre-A issues, if you will.

I am often a little heartbroken and bewildered as I read many of the stories here and especially the response. To me, far too often, we betrayed spouses have determined that the wayward spouse cheated because they are inherently bad or broken in such a way that change is impossible or at best extremely rare. I just see it differently.

It warms my heart to hear your voice about your wife. It is tender even in the knowledge of the pain she created. If anything is rare, that is. She is a lucky gal and I believe you are as well. Good can come from bad. I believe it is more of a choice than an absolute.

As always, I appreciate your perspective and advice.

Asterisk

BondJaneBond,

I think what I would term "malaise" is very common, even long term, after affairs. How can it not be, you discovered a whole side of your spouse, a very negative and destructive side that hurt you greatly. You never thought that could possible happen, for many people it seems to come out of nowhere as a great surprise. How then can something you never knew existed before, and that emerged out of seemingly nowhere, be trusted not to emerge again? That doesn't make sense to me.

I’ll be honest, this was a tough read for me. I do not wish to be combative, and I want to be supportive of what works for your safety and happiness. However, it would appear that we see wayward spouses and their ability to change very differently. I know you are not alone; I read this interpretation often here. It just hasn’t been my experience. I will say though, I do agree with your last line: "That it doesn’t make sense to me." I struggled for 3 decades because I thought I could make sense of her and my friend’s decision to have an affair. No matter the combination of information I just couldn’t dial the correct combination to unlock the mystery. It was here, over the last few months, that I began to understand and accept that the affair created by two good people would never make sense. The best I can do is to accept it happened due to their deficiencies not mine. But deficiencies can be shored up and or discarded.

So blame THEM, blame the unfaithful, it is THEIR FAULT, and stop blaming yourself. It is part of the price of trying to fix what THEY did.

The above quote puzzles me. I am open to more discussion on this. Do you see me as "blaming myself"? You are not the 1st person here to suggest that I do, and I just don’t see where I am guilty of it. I do accept that nothing happens in a void and that I may have a role in whatever happens within my relationships. And that I’d be in error not to self-examine. However, I don’t know how to be clearer but I will attempt to say it again. My wife’s decision to cheat falls 100% on my wife. She had options, far better options, far less destructive options, and yet she chose the worst of them all. Why? Honestly, I’ll never know the answer to that. And I wish I did, but I don’t and that is where I had a big decision to make. Stay or leave. I chose to stay and even with all the pain involved I do not regret that decision. My wife is an amazing woman who made a terrible choice and was unbelievably skillful at hiding it. I do not take the blame for either of those.

What is important to me is that I understand that I have a choice to write my interpretation of my story (So do you) as I understand it to be today. I had no choice in my wife’s decision to cheat. But I do have a choice as to whether I can find comfort and internal peace within myself despite what she did in the past or might do in the future. The past is gone and the future is not here, so I need to keep myself in this moment. And what it is in this moment is that I am deeply happy and secure in my relationship with my wife. And I plan to enjoy it to its fullest. If she chooses to cheat again, no matter the reason, then I will decide at that moment as to whether the relationship is worthy of my time and efforts.

I guess the bottom line is, I believe in hope. I believe in my wife. I am willing to take the risk.

Asterisks

Asterisk:

That was very well written and your last paragraph expresses exactly my situation. Thank you.